Food with Mark Bittman: Bob Klein and David Killilea

What the hell is whole wheat, anyway?

Published August 27, 2025

Instagram/@communitygrains

As it turns out, there are many claims about whole wheat that are false. So today we’re talking about wheat in general, and where good wheat comes from, and what it is. I have two guests: One is my old friend Bob Klein, who is the founder and president of Community Grains, and who, about 20 years ago, was looking for a high-quality, locally sourced whole wheat flour to make the house pasta at Oliveto—the pioneering Oakland restaurant that he founded (and which he closed a few years back); he found that that was harder than he thought it’d be. That’s how Community Grains was started, a company that sources simply the best wheat from California farmers and turns it into flour, pasta, bread, and other products.

My other guest is David Killilea, who’s a research scientist based at UC San Francisco. David joined us in large part because he ran a study that looked at which “whole grain” flours and other products on the market actually contain whole grain. (You can see that study here.) It’s fascinating.

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